Social A's: When Two Men Fall In Love….
Dear Lady of Answers,
Last summer, I met the love of my life. He is entrancing, gorgeous, hilarious, unusual, and has many other good qualities. All of my friends, to a wo/man, are thoroughly, 100% approving. Lest anyone be bitterly judging me, please know that I had been dating extensively (and apparently wrongly) for TWENTY-THREE FUCKING YEARS.
When two men fall in love and wish to merge their assets, or, should I say, in my case, their debts, a strange new world of options awaits them. For instance, my gay upstairs neighbor recently appeared with a ring on his finger. He is affianced! (That is a word that always reminds me of "refinanced" and I suppose it's not too much different, don't you think?) I was shocked. I suppose I am from another time, even though I am from the Generation X.
I have spent most of my life avoiding man-on-woman weddings, as I have been of the opinion that no one should marry until all could marry. But now it seems everyone can (offer void in 44 states). So, should I?
I was never told when and how and why to marry, because it was never going to be an option. I am old enough and experienced enough to judge character, and to know myself, and know when I'm in love. But I don't have any idea, or any training, regarding how I should know that I should be married, or when, or why, or where, or with what flowers, or with what best wo/men…. Or should I even engage with the patriarchy at all? Why be boring for a blender, as the lesbians say. Oh, ACK, in the immortal words of Cathy!
Signed,
Formerly Always Never A Bridesmaid
Dear Formerly Always Never,
First of all congratulations. You have attained the summit of possible human achievement. (Really!) Now grab it with both hands and don't let go!! (Not really.)
Not that I am going to actually try to dissuade you from being married, FANAB. I am as much of a sucker for the ceremony of the bells and lace as the next Joni Mitchell. And simply by being gay you have eliminated like 50% of my possible objections to the institution of marriage—the "to love, honor and obey" stuff that creeps in among the readings from J.G. Ballard and Cambodian translations of Cranberries songs at even the most alterna- of modern-day heterosexual weddings. Women who think they want to be married have to grapple with the historical role of marriage as a tool the patriarchy uses to subordinate women; you are not a woman so, head on over to the Tom Ford boutique, pick up one of those little registry stun-gun things and start zapping!
OK, but actually put the stun-gun down and let's talk about a couple of practical details for a second.
You raise an interesting point when you mention the similarity of the words "affianced" and "refinanced." Now, if you are planning to jointly own property or jointly raise some children, legally turning your relationship into a small business makes practical sense. But the logic that two people ought to mingle their bank accounts simply because they are in love—well, that has always seemed flawed, to me. Money, as Cyndi Lauper so astutely pointed out, changes everything. Think of the last time you had a relationship—not a romantic relationship, necessarily, but a roommate relationship or parent-child relationship—where you felt financially beholden to someone, or someone felt financially beholden to you. Did that dynamic subtly poison the relationship?
Without the cushion of cultural assumptions like "I'm the man and I'm the provider, it's my job to take care of my family," the merger aspect of marriage seems to me to be a recipe for inevitable conflict. But then again, so does having to keep track of who paid for what in a relationship where both parties maintain their fiscal independence, so this issue is not a dealbreaker so much as it is, like, something to keep in mind. There is actually a lot of boring, legal stuff to keep in mind. That's the thing about marriage: on the one hand, it is this quasi-mystical union of souls, and on the other hand it is like a trip to the DMV.
Also, are you going to, you know, forsake all others? I know this is horribly old-fashioned and unrealistic of me, but I think you should. I guess open marriages work for some people, but let's be honest about the fact that those people are, for the most part, crazy freaks. (Or: fans of subtle emotional torture and denial.) I mean, shit happens, but preplanned shit with rules happening constantly just seems like it defeats the purpose. And there is a purpose, right? Let's quickly run down a list of bad reasons to get married:
1) Might as well.
2) To make your single friends have to spend a day with the thought "What if I never find this kind of love" in the back of their minds at all times.
3) For housewares.
4) To make your parents happy.
5) In order to have a big party where people have to treat you special while they seethe with tragic envy (see #2).
6) Possibility of appearing in Vows column.
So what are the good reasons? Well, I can really only think of one.
Recently a friend of mine went out for drinks with a mutual friend of ours who's getting married soon. When my friend got back from the drinks I asked, "How is [Mutual Friend?]"
"He's freaking out about the wedding."
"Why?"
"I don't know … maybe because it's terrifying to imagine spending the rest of your life with the same person? I mean, don't you think it's terrifying to imagine spending the rest of your life with the same person?"
"It is totally terrifying to imagine spending the rest of your life with the same person," I said, and I meant it.
It is terrifying! Of course it is terrifying. But I still felt disquieted by this conversation, and I only figured out why a few days later, when I realized that there is a corollary to what I'd said.
I don't think it's possible to love someone so much that the horror of "till death do us part" is eliminated. But maybe it's possible—I want to believe that it's possible—to love someone so much that this terror get superseded by a bigger fear. So if your terror of spending the rest of your life without this person outweighs your terror of spending the rest of your life with him—then, FANAB, you should marry him.
Oh, and I like this place, for flowers, if you're doing it in New York.
Questions? Write to advice at theawl.com!
Program Note: First person to pedantically mention The Brains gets garroted.
I wish I was brainy enough to be pedantic.
Sigh, I should have said "As Cyndi Lauper, using words written by The Brains, popularly pointed out," I guess.
Of course not. I just reckoned some Johnny Massengill would jump in here and question your indie cred.
Good thing that didn't happen!
"Cyndi Lauper"?! I believe you mean "As Liza Minnelli and Joel Grey pointed out.."
I just want to thank you for putting that Cyndi Lauper song in my head.
Srsly. I fucking love that song.
OMG I totally thought you meant The Brains of this operation (Choire).
The main difference being that, during trips to the DMV, I've been able to successfully back into the space more often than not.
Honey, do you just think up six or seven unrelated sentences every morning and then simply post those sentences into the comments? Wait, you're using the first lines from the chapters of all of Douglas Coupland's novels, arent you?
I met the greatest guy in the world and after dating for a while he was still a little non-committal on being in a long-term relationship. I made up my mind to call of the relationship because if he didn't realize how great it was, he was just wasting my time.
On the night I decided to tell him how I felt he beat me to the punch with: "You know how I told you I was scared of being in a relationship? I'm more scared of not spending the rest of my life with you."
Two years later a marriage. Five years after that a divorce.
My advice: don't get married. The only exceptions are if you want kids and think it's best for the kids to have married parents or if you are a stay-at-home or lesser earning spouse and you want alimony after the break up.
Or you need to be added to their health insurance and their company does not accept domestic partners. Otherwise I can't see any benefit to marriage.
I've always been a sucker for the idea of formally, officially, creating a new family unit. (Whether family is kids, dogs, or two people.) Saying, in front of your community of family, friends, whatever – we are making a life together.
Yes, I got this from The Last Five Years.
And yes, I am putting a musical theatre reference in every comment I make today.
Giving your partner a Green Card is another good reason. That's why I got married.
It seems like such an emotional gamble. When I see people really excited about the prospect–or really pressuring their mate to propose or something–I immediately think, "there's no way they thought this through entirely, or they'd be much more…"
Serious? Professional? I dunno. Marriage is scary, y'all. (I'm gay, though, so…)
I'm straight and I second "Marriage is scary, y’all." But I can understand it, just not in people who are really, really young. I just don't get how high school sweethearts can get married after graduating from HS. IMHO I cannot fathom how those things work out.
I think you have to want to be somebody's life partner, and want somebody to be your partner, plus want this particular somebody to be that partner. Which is basically what you said, but less about fear.
And once I came to the aforementioned realization about myself, I got de-fianced. Which was hard.
I can't tell you how much that concept creeps me out. It's about as appealing as having a conjoined twin.
Yes! And I'm capable of cooperating, but I'd really rather do my own thing.
Emily, I hate that I ever doubted you. Well done.
I also hate that you ever doubted me!
I am ashamed and without excuse.
I am officiating a wedding this summer. Please Emily may I translate this into Cambodian for the homily?
Better not be two dudes. Why do you hate America?
Wow. Someone put up with dating for 23 years? You are awesome and therefore you at least need a bachelor party with 50 or so really slutty Diesel models to humor you, even without a wedding.
All this "terror" stuff is so interesting to consider. I have been with my boyfriend for five years. We live together, and although we're not engaged, or planning to get engaged in the near future, we both operate under the assumption that we'll get married eventually. In the context of this relationship, the idea of marriage doesn't hold any terror for me one way or the other. It's more like, well, of course we would never want to NOT be together, so we'll probably get married at some point.
I don't see what the big deal is. I plan on getting married at least five or six times. Christmas dinner at my house is going to be huge.
I'm like the only gay-divorced person in the world, but I couldn't get a gay divorce because I couldn't get gay married. So his essential robbing of me for $16K had no legal code to which I could point.
In summary, I'm for gay marriage, but very unlikely to ever do it.
Yeah, I am really more interested to see how this all eventually will play out in the divorce courts and the ensuing LOGO MOWs.
Or, like is my opinion with many, though not all, things: it's worked for thousands of years for a lot of people. Give it a shot.
I have yet to come across a relationship that ended with the people involved saying: "It would've worked out, if not for the fact that we got married".
But I'm probably being naive and someone will jump down my throat and say: I know Person X and Person Y and that's EXACTLY what they said when they got divorced.
So.
Well, not to jump all over you, but yes, but that IS exactly what I've heard from friends. In fact, I just heard it again last week from a friend who got married two years ago after living with his girl for ten years. Things are not going well, and his exact quote was, "Don't ever get married. Marriage changes everything."
Is it really marriage, though? Or just getting sucked into the routineness and constant responsibility and proximity that long-term relationships inevitably result in?
If they'd lived together (happily) for ten years before getting married, then the suckage probably has more to do with expectations and pressure and social garbage associated with marriage (or maybe even the wedding!) than with responsibility or proximity.
Hear hear.
I don't think your take on the finances of marriage makes a lot of sense. I agree that when someone feels "financially beholden" to a partner or friend, bad things happen to this relationship. HOWEVER, marriage's merging of assets gets rid of this problem. No one has to feel inferior or awkward about who is paying for dinner, who is paying more for rent, etc., because the money is explicitly the same.
Yes, of course people understand that one person's paycheck probably makes the bank account go up more each month than the other person's, but the symbolism of having one credit card, both names on the deed, etc., is strong. (The deed brings up further issues. For many people, their house is a very significant portion of their net worth, so probably both partners will be contributing to the payments and owning some of the house. It is harder to say that 70% of the house belongs to one person, and 30% to the other. And having that stated on the deed would cause retarded amounts of tension.) I really don't see how marriage/formally merging assets would do anything but improve tension springing from fiscal inequality.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't you saying to only marry (or don't marry) out of fear? I think all the terror involved should serve as an indication of what a sham marriage is.
Now I've felt a few times — when I was younger (in my twenties) — that I could never be without whoever my girlfriend was at the time; I always saw us spending the rest of our lives together (and it never terrorized me; in fact, I've felt like that about all my girlfriends, this why I've had very few long term relationships.) But then we'd inevitably grow apart(per the Golden Rule of twentysomething relationships) and later I couldn't believe I felt that way about another person. Sad, but true.
The older I've gotten (I'm 37 now), the more I realize I'll probably never get married, and I'm more than okay with that. I still believe in Love, and companionship, and trust and honoring, but like you illustrated: marriage is antithetical to human aspirations, which are ceaseless, and it has nothing to do with love and everything to do with fear. So you might as well convert to Christianity and repent while you're at it.
But there's also the jewelry. It's really sparkly!
Okay, don't garrote me for that! I'm saying it (mainly!) in jest. And also because I just got engaged this month. But after ten years together! (Starting considerably AFTER college, thankyouverymuch.) So I'm now actually contracted to Feel The Magic.
(Also, Emily's absolutely right about the fear-of-being-without-the-person-for-the-rest-of-your-life thing.)
I'm very happy for you! Because your descriptions of Wes Mantooth make him seem like a person you have a solid relationship with, and who understands how delightful you are.
This is good, but perhaps you should have disclosed that you periodically get proposed to in the comments of various blogs.
Fruitless endeavor, Patrick.
She Has Spoken.
Dear FANAB,
I enjoyed your very incestuous Social Q but did you read Emily's column last time? About trying to get out of going to a wedding b/c, you know, they suck? I used to like the gays b/c they never put in me in that awful position of inventing yet another dying relative so I could not show at their weddings at the really rude last minute. Or else going and resenting my erstwhile friends for all the money spent and time wasted eating bad food and drinking cheap wine in uncomfortable circumstances with someone's born again cousins from Texas.
Now between you and the affianced upstairs neighbor, I am going off the gays. If you must marry, may I recommend elopement?
Love and xxs,
The Fitta
Yes, many of us have often thought, someday, I'll meet a guy who makes me so fearful I'll marry him. Some of us have even fantasized about having gay friends. You had me till:
"Oh, and I like this place, for flowers, if you’re doing it in New York."
Uh, Earth to Tardgirl? There may be a bill stalled in the state senate, but for now there is no same-sex marriage in New York!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage_in_New_York
But it's okay, in my home city of Chicago you can't get married if you fail the inbred homophobe blood test. Tough world out there.
That was actually kind of beautiful, in the end there. Nice.
The usual circle jerk.
The usual asshole.